Gwinnett County Trash Advisory Committee

Solid Waste Committee Meeting minutes
Meeting Number 5
Mountain Park Community Center
February 23, 2009
Mike Royal opened the meeting, and introduced the committee and its purpose. The first 45 minutes are reserved for public input and the last 45 minutes will be reserved for the committee to discuss the issues and comments it has heard. We are a group of concerned citizens put together by Mike Beaudreau to hear citizen concerns and recommend solutions to the solid waste problem. We will write a report that the rest of the BOC can use to help them make decisions about the problem.
2 ground rules – constructive criticism, thoughts and concerns are welcome but it is not a forum to trash anyone. Rule 2 – 2 minute time limit to discuss your concerns.
Citizen Input
Mike B addressed the audience regarding the problem with lawsuits, committee’s role, etc.
Committee introduced themselves and gave their backgrounds.
Elizabeth Dolcee – Unincorp. Gwinnett – Storm drainage gave price, came up with title, gave money. Upset that paid fee but has not received service. Been pleased with trash pickup but trash plan is being crammed down throats. Don’t like govt telling us what trash service we must use.
Cindy Murphy – Mountain Park Res. – has Waste industries – bill going up 27%. Hasn’t heard from elected officials.
Wanda Philpot – Crestview S/D – sent Chairman Bannister email, called GCB – got response. No communication when GCB initiated plan. Never got good answer. Today’s meeting not communicated well. Business plan should be laid out. Should know how much will cost before it is approved.
Dave Robney – Lilburn – $20 more. Would pay $70 /quarter with new program Need to keep enough companies to keep competitive bidding.
Pat Lark – S of Hwy 78. Has committee looked into County sanitation dept? Mike R – something we need to consider. Will you hire County employees instead of using private enterprise? Mike R – that’s one option on table that County could consider. Doesn’t think BOC will do that.
Ed Philpot – Crestwood Drive – heard of problems with collection, but is unaware of it. Don’t want to pay additional $.
Goram – Had fill of Government – county shouldn’t be in trash business. Lilburn tried to annex. Happy w/ status quo.
Unincorporated Gwinnett near Snellville – Laundry list of fines that trash police were going to levy. Has that been deep sixed? Mike R – part of what judge has restrained. –
Mike B – the fines were for trash being placed in recycling bin. $500 fine for spoiling recyclables – Not complying with ordinance could cause $500 fine. Where can we go to read state and fed requirements – Mike R – DCA. Randy Hartman here tonight.
Jonie – Lilburn – 1 garbage co for 32 years, just name changed. Problems started with multiple contracts. Don’t give out multiple contracts. Town in NY picked up garbage and if you had problem, Commissioner would take care of. Mike B – paradox –
committee has heard arguments for public and private. Right now it’s free for all.
Citizen – too many garbage trucks. Mike b – that’s what the old new plan tried to address.
Dan Stephenson – owns 5 properties – Harmony Grove Road. – Multi-family duplexes is what he owns. These cause trouble – has no intention of being in utility business – I will be responsible for tenants. If apartment is vacant, I will still pay for trash – I’ve got to collect – tenants don’t like change. Hope committee realizes impact to multifamily properties. Mike R – trying to formulate plan.
Unidentified Citizen – Why do you want to stick nose in my garbage? Don’t shove it down my throat. Will taxes be lowered once you get out of the business. Mike B – Randy Hartman can give synopsis about state requirements.
Randy Hatman, Director of Office of Solid Waste Management – DCA – summarized solid waste plan requirements (see meeting 4 minutes). Has Waste Management not performed adequately. RH – not the issue – County must have plan – requirements in place since early 1990s.
Diedre – Lilburn – how often is plan updated – Mike R – every ten years – County is implementing plan. – Committee is looking at implementing plan better. RH – County has an approved plan – County is talking about collection component to plan.
Mark Barber – Mountain Park – impropriety is main issue – No warning of implementation – Mike B – there were 7 news articles discussing plan, public input
meetings were held – lots of notice given. Who determined GCB should bid – Mike B – bids are public information. Anyone can obtain them.
Bill Nye – Lake Lucerne Rd – cost is $57 per quarter – includes recycling, white goods, etc. First aware of committee at second meeting. Is this done deal? Hearing that it is. Logistics is important to waste removal – should not be broken up in multiple zones. Not right to average cost – Good base stabilization is necessary for god road. Trash is being
thrown out by kids.
Rich E – addressed trucks impact on roads.
Joe Sorrell – Summerhill S/D – had a collection model for years – people like it. County has not done a good job explaining why new model is better. Is committee looking at other models around state?
Rich E – county did have study done by solid waste consultant.
Mike R – Committee is looking at this.
Hugh Jackson – 13 month resident – Drove truck for 47 years – garbage trucks are similar with axel spacing. 6 trips per week is tearing up roads. Believes in recycling. Wants 1 truck per week plus 1 for recycling. Too many trucks with fumes. Don’t
understand why there are three companies when there could be one.
Phillis Nye – recycling question – where does this go? Mike R – Haulers are responsible for recycling – some use different vendors for these services. Enjoined program planned to build recycling center. That’s part of the debate. No continuity between haulers. Could haulers be required to go to one center? Yes.
Paul Parman – GCB started this when they met with community and told them they would get rid of trucks. Community wanted it.
Bart Zogby – thanks for being here and listening. It’s never successful to be angry. Private enterprise is probably more efficient than government – hope committee can devise solution to allow haulers to do that.
Noel Walton – Vivid Court – Billing is a problem. Folks are upset about using tax bill. Easy way to get it done. He has no problem with it.
Kenneth Kemp – Are recommendations going to be published before going to County Commission? Mike R – they will be published but we don’t know. KK – Do present haulers have to have landfills? MR – landfills are permitted separately. Mike B – fee
does not go to county.
Jim Hardin – Lilburn – involved in surveys – 27 homes in neighborhood and have four haulers. We want all haulers to come on same day. Need relief from traffic as well.
Norma Shark – 32 year resident – Once all this is done, will commission meeting be open, or something we hear about later? MB – will be open – every meeting is open with exception of executive session when discussing litigation.
Tom Cordelle – Has to return to work. Very few things govt. does better than private sector – For private enterprise competing for your dollar – will not address truck problem – Is not for County mandating trash collection – Comments have been similar from
meeting to meeting.
John Massey – Unincorporated Gwinnett – have 7 haulers that have done good job. Haulers operated under $150k bond – new plan required $2million bond. Threw some little guys out. New plan will cost more. Bond needs to be reasonable. Mike R – we
will be discussing bonds.
Robert Baggett – 42 year resident – saw new trucks in paper – are they sitting? What will happen with GCB? Doesn’t like them.
Unidentified citizen – had one hauler once – didn’t work. Heard it was fault of commissioners.
Mike R – Comments heard tonight are similar to what we have heard in other meetings. One more meeting will include haulers. Next Monday night March 3 with Haulers and public – meeting will start at 6:00pm to 9:00pm. All meetings are open to public.
*************************End of Public Hearing ***********************
Did not hear as much tax bill issues as previously.
What is problem with tax bill? Chet – Will potentially be put on tax bill and increase escrow.
Mike R – if it’s not paid, they get a lien on house.
Pat M – People want to use business for trash collection. Hates laws that are not enforceable. Need on tax bill to enforce collection.
Rich E – good model is red-light cameras. Nature of process requires separate tickets. 20-30 percent non-collection rate results. Placing on tax bill will ensure people will use mandatory service.
Dan B – against tax billings – Let haulers collect. Believe in Mandatory pick-up. We need to work with existing system.
Mike B – yard waste component made new plan expensive.
Dan B – Haulers should bill. Issue in beginning was that we have folks not purchasing trash collection. County should track.
Patrick – Haulers prefer typically that govt. collects. Solid Waste collection fee can be placed as ad-velorum tax – then more expensive properties pay more. Fee is across the map in terms of how done. County can assess a fee and not provide a service. Could also be on utility bills.
Patrick – lots of ways to bill, only one way to collect. Tax Bill.
Dan B – County has Quality of Life unit – is for enforcement.
Mike B – a lot is gut reaction to and ignorance. Socialism argument.
Dan B – haulers could work to bill and enforce.
Mike R – mandatory service – are we in favor?
Dan B – need to discuss mandatory argument. Mandatory pickup? – unanimous yes for mandatory hauler pickup.
Mike B – remember – the more exceptions, the more expensive. Should there be exceptions? – (2.8 million to GCB per year? For enforcement) divided on
whether there should be exceptions
Recycling – Are we agreed on 35 items – yes
Billing methodology – Divided on billing method
Choice of Hauler – RH – not sure how you can bid on a zone without assurance of residential units. HOA went out to bid and got lower price. Similar to what county is seeking to do. Can’t have fewer trucks and more choice.
Mike B – Service level agreements help ensure performance.
Dan B – resident too small to matter to single
hauler.
DVD passed out from DCA and recycling industry explaining single stream recycling.
Mike B – get lists ready to discuss how services affect price, etc. with haulers.
Dan B – can County facility handle all recycling – ans. – no, but there is capacity within private industry.
Carla D – Been watching for several weeks – on her street, neighbor’s garbage gets picked up by same company at different times.
Ron B – Would this have been easier if GCB had spent more on education?
Mike R – don’t know.
Motion to approve last meetings minutes – moved and seconded passed unanimously.

Hi DS~The final report will be compiled and sent via email to the committee members for review. Hopefully this will happen within the next week. There will not be another meeting of the committee. As far as the minutes from the last meeting….

Solid Waste Committee Meeting minutes
Meeting Number 6
Gwinnett Justice and Administration Center
March 2, 2009

Mike Royal opened the meeting, and introduced the committee and its purpose. The first 45 minutes are reserved for Hauler input, the next 45 minutes will be reserved for public input, and then the committee will discuss the issues and comments it has heard. We are a group of concerned citizens put together by Mike Beaudreau to hear citizen concerns and recommend solutions to the solid waste problem. We will write a report that the rest of the BOC can use to help them make decisions about the problem.

2 ground rules – constructive criticism, questions, thoughts and concerns are welcome but it is not a forum to trash anyone. Rule 2 – 2 minute time limit to discuss your concerns.

Hauler Input

Luann Chambers – SP1 Recycling – does the processing for majority of haulers in GC. Single stream processing since 2005. 35 items take primary categories and break it down into subcategories (ie glass, paper, etc.). Key is educating people so people know what they can recycle. Public needs a bigger container than exists right now. Some things to discuss – works with 90% of haulers. 1600 to 2000 tons of recyclables per month. In new proposal, an additional facility would be built on Cedars Road. Comments:

1. facility needs to handle single stream. Allows processor to separate goods.
2. Process 8000 tons per month. Processing 90% of tonnage in GC. Do DeKalb Co., City of Atlanta, others.
Mike R – can private sector handle 35 stream recycling without any additional taxpayer expense? Ans. yes, absolutely, if use flow control. Meaning all recyclables would go to GCB facility. If that happens, SP2 would shut down in L’ville. If new facility is not built, GCB’s satellite facility can’t handle.
Luann C – key is to have mechanism to report numbers. SP3 tracks those so that County can show recycling is increasing, etc. Stability is there. Have handled recycling for years.
Pat M – does twice monthly pick up have detrimental affect on operations of facility.
Ans. – once per week is better. People can get confused or frustrated with twice monthly
pickup.
Pat M – does it cost less? – Luann C depends on hauler.
Luann C- price fluctuations – SP4 gives rebates to compensate for market fluctuations.

Mike R – any haulers make prepared statements?
Anthony – Red Oak – Littering issue – equivalent of 25 garbage trucks per week. It is overblown number – Atlanta has mandatory garbage – still has litter. GCB said 75% people wanted more recycling – but only have 30% participation in recycling programs. Thinks its because education – need mandatory recycling to get 75% participation – every other week wont reduce price, but will reduce truck traffic. Discussed rates – locking in rates doesn’t do justice – bidders will increase prices to protect themselves. Franchise system deteriorates after first day. No incentive to improve. Why not increase franchise fees to give incentives. Tough to educate customers. There are a lot of different needs from residents. One size fits all does not work. Does not meet everyone’s needs.

Jack Perko & Hal Risher – Robertson Sanitation/Republic/Allied – Asked workers to stand and be recognized. Many workers are still out collecting. Think about who you are affecting. Commends committee. Tough issue. Tough decisions. Poll – Feb 26 by Mcglauphlin & Associates – registered voters – margin of error of 5.6%. – Number 1 item – citizens are aware of trash proposals 86% – No. 2 – Support of private enterprise Support or oppose plan to remove choice. 66% opposed plan No. 3 opposition to tax increases – 83% oppose – item 4 concern about jobs – how do you feel about fellow
citizens losing jobs if current haulers are prevented from 80% oppose plan if existing haulers leave county. No 5 – support for elected officials – 77% would be less likely to support elected officials. Believe free enterprise is way to go.

Hal R – SP5 has been handling recyclables since October. Volume going to GCB was
from him as partner – generated funds to continue programs –

Pat M – Is there savings for twice monthly collection – Studies indicated there was problem with participation

Jack P – encourage to not have weekly mandatory yard waste collection.

Pat M – How many customers does allied have in Gwinnett – 90,000 How many
complaints – 7 per day.

Hal R – service standards have been in place for years.

What specifics about recycling would you propose – Recycle Bank of America – Hal described that program.

Dan B – talked about 1 hauler – which is best? Is there any drawback to having 1 hauler rather than multiple. Dan – could you work with another hauler? Hal – Natural progression is – free for all is not to anyone’s advantage – this system has small number
of haulers that has produced high level of service. Dan – one complaint has been that there are multiple haulers in nhoods – can the haulers cooperate to collect on same day – wouldn’t rule it out.

Ron – don’t know what BOC will do – If there were 2 or 3 per district, what do haulers think about that? Would that create free market situation? – Hal – had this conversation before about free choice vs. exclusivity – Need to think about it. Not sure what you get at end of day. How do they compete going forward? Would need to be big zones.

Ron – Is one hauler better than 3? – Depends on what your trying to accomplish – less trucks, or better service?

Pat – goal was to have one hauler per nhood – we have free enterprise reason to sell hoas. Think of HOA on steroids –

Terry – point about transition is good. If we allowed process whereby you negotiated bid with selected zones, is that something you could do? – Hal – how do you allow in certain areas?

How to avoid transition fee – should reuse and recycle existing equipment

Art – If someone bid on a district, what efficiencies could be had? – becomes regulated by government if franchised.

Mike B – how can it be possible to bid if you don’t have all households guaranteed – ans – make more assumptions.
Mike R – billing – easy to do . Need to build in % of bad debt. Hal – don’t think there would be problem comparing customer lists to ensure mandatory aspect.

Art – costs more for private companies6 to send out multiple bills than for the County to send out one bill.

LC – 20,000 without fostered discussion – back to question – how can you capture those not participating – haulers can compare customer lists. Should be an administrative function of County.

Terri – When speaking of transition, what is reasonable time? – number of states have written law dictating – GA state only has laws pertaining to comm. Service. You would pick normal term of contract (5 to 7 yrs).

Buddy Johnson – Southern Sanitation – free enterprise built America. Dream to build a business in county born and raised – give to sons, or sell and retire – RFP was against small haulers – County and GCB was taking business – 90% is Gwinnett business. Last
few years told us changes were coming. Communication was problem. Need to sit down with BOC and work it out. No reason to be kicked out. County has high standard. Wouldn’t be in business if he did a poor job.

Kevin Byrd – echos everything – Bond issue – pay as you go contract – would not get far ahead – small guy could not compete – had to do a good job or wouldn’t be in business.

Mike R – would different bond requirement have made it better?

***********************End of Hauler comments**********************

Citizen Comments:

Mike R – keep comments to two minutes – tell us your name – need constructive
criticism, ideas. Keep comments dignified.

Barbara Fireside – 1993 – worked for BFI as residential sales manager – Husband is 16 year vet of Allied – live in n’hood of 435 homes – people are confused – fielded many questions. Please don’t make this a gov’t decision. Picked Gwinnett to live and
remembers advantage of making choice in haulers. Educate people. Children will learn about recycling – take it home and parents listen.

Dan Archer – Kilcrease Road – happy with way system was working – could find people that don’t have garbage pickup with county databases.

Robert – here as citizen – free enterprise is giving him individual right to choose. Government doesn’t have right to make choice.

Issac Feldner – resident of Duluth and grayson? – Unincorporated – Was being laid off – losing his family of employees – would have broken up families – would lose houses, cars. Had to figure out if he would have car at end of day. We pick up same day. GC
already hurting.

Lisa Swift – resident of gwinnett – Husband worked for Allied for 11 years – hard worker – will die at that company – Grandmother upset about tax bill. People should choose.

Bob Lumpkin – Dacula bluff – 98 homes – 1 entrance – 11 trucks in and 11 trucks out – don’t need five haulers for that many homes – no incentive to be that productive – surcharge subsidizes multiple haulers to drive past house. Billing – doesn’t make a difference. People that pay for trash at business should have exemption. Should be using less fossil fuels.

Walter Cleveland – roll off driver for United Waste – affects him indirectly – here for residential folks in company

Steve Wood – Robertson Sanitation – not only drivers that might lose jobs – office people also. If drivers lose jobs, what about families? Trying to provide for them. How many jobs will be taken away – will hurt economy – we need our jobs – we are dedicated
to serving customer – there will be people on street because of lost jobs — trying to make world a better place for our children.

Debbie Baker – inside sales – represent fellow employees – sits near customer service area – who will be hauler – customers have been loyal and its like a big family – 250 employees – mulitple family members have jobs. Take pride in excellent customer
service standards. Work hard. Don’t put our jobs in jeopardy. Don’t trash our jobs.

Unintelligible name – Lawrenceville resident – Robertson employee – age will prevent him from getting another job. Current firm is his family. – Don’t want to be out on street.
Doesn’t want to get laid off. Was scheduled to be laid off. Other employees said they would take care of him.

Unintelligible name – Allied Waste – 13 trucks when started – now service 90,000. 400 employees – people work their way up. Father died in truck – company means a lot to him. Not in your hands, but is in BOC hands – report to them – poor service doesn’t make it. Single company will not give good service. Competition is healthy for county.

Horace Smith – thank you for listening – not associated with firms – commendable that county has taken this approach – afraid that these companies will be put out of business. Has used two of these companies. Hidden Falls – 8 trucks/week go through – not pretty – should work something out where some neighborhoods can reduce traffic.

Student from GA Gwinnett college – for project – saw hauler pick up dropped items – how is county going to address service issues? Concerned about service declining.

Mike Ochoa – Meadow Lane – citizen and employee – no one wants to lose jobs – there are some quality of life issues being addressed. Hope that you have found reasonable folks in industry to work with. 800 lb gorilla is County – wants to address problems –
need something less onerous than last process. Can’t parcel out neighbirhoods – understands that. Need to solve some way.

************************End of Citizen Comments**************************

Mike R – we have been listening – same issues have come up – here because process failed – we think we can do better – address some of the public problems that current system has failed to. Seen some folks all 5 times – gotten hundreds of comments. We
will decide tonight about what to do next about report. Goal is March 17 to deliver recommendations.

LC – lived here for 10 years because of school system – been pleased with things going on in County – moved here from NY – we have wonderful people here, but there is difference of opinion, and that is nature of democracy – thanks everyone for your time.

The committee discussed the issues.

View the recommendations along with some interesting additional information by following this link:

Gwinnett Trash Committee Recommendations

Hi Mack

The link you posted above about the recommendations you made isn’t working. I am interested in seeing what you have to say.

Mike G

Mike Gills last blog post..BOC Contract with Gwinnett Clean and Beautiful Terminated

I am very unhappy with the present situation because the quality of service has gotten worse over the three years since I moved to Lawrencville, and the demands of the vendor have gotten obsene. There is no “recycling” program with my vendor. They consider your account to be “past due” if it is not paid a month before the service period begins, and their “customer service” is about as hostle as Nazi consentration camp guards. I would like to be able to choose between vendors who compete for my business rather than deal with vultures who have me over a trash barrel.